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Global Weirding

 
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cfos



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 1:58 pm    Post subject: Global Weirding Reply with quote

I mentioned something about this in reference to one of Irish's posts regarding the rain. Anyway, since I couldn't remember the guy who coined the phrase I did a search and found this nicely written article. Care to discuss?

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/02/opinion/02friedman.html
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Global weirding is probably making it sound a little more random than it is though. Global weather patterns are changing in response to a slight increase in average sea surface temperatures, but also more than likely as part of greater climatic cycles that we haven't really been aware of because we haven't been around long enough to notice them.

As I was complaining about in my other post, Ireland has been getting consistently wetter during the summer months, but probably no warmer. Our winters are definitely getting milder, but if the current trend for milder winters continues across northern Europe and up into the Arctic, enough fresh meltwater will enter the Atlantic to shut down the Atlantic Conveyor temporarily, at which point it will get a lot colder here very suddenly for a few years. The last time this happened was at the end of the 19th century, when the Thames in London had over a metre of ice on it. We are at the same latitude as Newfoundland, after all.

I guess my point is that I think we can point at man's influence as a possible aggravator of natural cycles, but that there's an awful lot more going on than simply saying more carbon = global warming = temperature rise.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whatever the case, reducing carbon emissions wouldn't hurt.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You'll find no argument here...
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Simon_Says wrote:
Whatever the case, reducing carbon emissions wouldn't hurt.


But of course, easier said than done...
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just because it's hard to do means we shouldn't do it?
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 10:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well it's now rooted deep into our systems and communities that it would be very difficult to change. People are trying to find good replacements, but so far those attempts have not been successful. And of course, there are alot of people who are against that idea, mainly to keep their own profits healthy.

Really, it's just alot of changes are going to have to be initiated to try and reduce carbon emissions. There alot of background forces that need to be taken into consideration, but yes, people are trying to improve our problems.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 19, 2008 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Az, you're hand-waving. I'm not sure who you are refering to regarding the "they" that want to make profit. Public transportation and carpooling are obvious options. Biking to school/work is another. Refusing to buy bottled water would drastrically impact the environment. There are plenty of other options and I'm not clear on what sort of "background forces" require consideration. The only thing that requires consideration is making a sacrifice of time/convenience/etc. in order to reduce harm to the environment. My guess is, that most of these "option" would also save money so you can't argue that it would be more costly.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Az is also missing my point. We all know that reducing pollution and curbing global warming would be massive and difficult undertakings (though people still think the problem can be solved technologically, when it's root of the problem lies in modern human mentalities). That's no reason to just give up.

When Hitler invade Poland, did the rest of world think to themselves "Damn. The Fuhrer and his boys are going to tear the world apart. But it's too much effort and money to stop them. I guess I'll just surrender now..."?

Consider that the Third Reich was only finally opposed after the very dramatic invasion of Poland. Before that the world was content to let things start going down the drain. Doesn't that second sentence ring any bells? It's also taken for granted that World War II would never have been so bloody and costly and terrible had the world put it's foot down earlier. We're experiencing a similar event in human history: possible imminent disaster. We're approaching that possible disaster the same way we did before, on our asses.

We should be learning from our species' mistakes in the past, not repeating them. We should also be making our society more efficient and sustainable for it's own goddamn sake.

And, as Cfos noted, anti-global-warming action could also save money instead of burning it. As an addition to that, I'd also like to note that there's the long term to think about. In the extreme worst case scenario, global warming would melt polar ice, and the resulting increased sea levels would wipe out (or at least render uninhabitable) all of Earth's coastal cities. Cities such as Tokyo, New York, London, etc. I don't know about you but I'm not looking forward to that.

But, as I said before, the root of our current crises lies within man's minds, not man's tools. Consumerism, small-scope/short-term thinking, incorrect sorting of priorities, general social/cultural apathy, and even general stupidity are definitely problems prevalent in at least my corner of the planet. My visit to Scotland showed me that there, those problems are apparently almost non-existent. I think that might be suggestive of why G.B. launched the world's most ambitious anti-greenhouse project, and is actually succeeding according to many reports.

We already have the technology to put carbon emissions in decline, but ultimately it rests with the economic and political leaders of the world to actually put that technology into action, and for cultural leaders to shift human mentality to something less parasitic. Every single one of us has the ability to become those leaders, great or small. And we have a responsibility to our descendants, fellow humans, and life on Earth in general to do so.
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cfos



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PostPosted: Fri Sep 19, 2008 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Simon_Says wrote:


When Hitler invade Poland, did the rest of world think to themselves "Damn. The Fuhrer and his boys are going to tear the world apart. But it's too much effort and money to stop them. I guess I'll just surrender now..."?


Any Frenchies care to respond?

Very Happy

I'm sorry, I need the Cliff Notes on your post Simon. To many words to read in the 30 second time bytes I have to read posts. Cool BUt, being a red-blooded American, I'm going to reply anyway... without having read all of the words.

In your closing paragraph you mention world leaders or politicians needing to be the ones to act. Only with a Despot/Communist (excluding China, of course) or some non-world power, nay, a utopia, will that happen. Under democracy in "large" countries the people vote for their elected officials and nobody is going to stay in office if what they preach and attempt to pass calls for a change in lifestyle. I'm talking about the US, here. Ain't gunna happen. "Leaders" are there to stay in office. Sure they talk about "change" but they want their paycheck just like everyone else. Also, their constiuents don't want to be told about how bad they are and how dumb they are and finally, WHAT they are going to HAVE to do.

Talk about change, but don't look to the leaders to do it. Has to come from the peeps.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 19, 2008 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cfos wrote:
Any Frenchies care to respond?

Hundreds of thousands of Free French soldiers, sailors and airmen continued to fight throughout the war, many of whom were killed in action while America was busy sitting on it's arse doing nothing.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 19, 2008 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not to mention the many Polish airmen who escaped and fought, and died, with the Allies. To both, and everyone else who fought against tyranny, oppression, and injustice, I take my hat off.

Cfos, I think it's apparent you didn't read the entirety of that paragraph. Long story short, I was calling people in general to take charge in whatever way they could not only to fight global warming, but in everything they do, i.e. become leaders, not followers. I.e. I was calling to 'the peeps' for change.

Master Chainsaw wrote:
... while America was busy sitting on it's arse doing nothing.
Still is, mate. Well, nothing effective at least.
-Edit- Nothing positive at least.
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bite your tongue - the incitement of small countries into hopeless conflicts is certainly having some kind of effect...
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 20, 2008 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tongue bit. Throbbing now. Icecream doesn't help. Futurama does though. Also post edited.
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 10:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No Simon, I didn't read your entire post. I can only handle about 30 sec worth of material at a time. Laughing
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 11:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cfos wrote:
No Simon, I didn't read your entire post. I can only handle about 30 sec worth of material at a time. Laughing


Hopefully, this doesn't carry through to your work?
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 1:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aurelyn wrote:
cfos wrote:
No Simon, I didn't read your entire post. I can only handle about 30 sec worth of material at a time. Laughing


Hopefully, this doesn't carry through to your work?


No, no. I've been rather productive. Last year I had 2 first author 'scripts published (should have been a middle author on a third). This year, 2 more first author and 1 second author.

In fact, I've just checked with the departmental HR-ish person and I haven't taken a vacation day this year. I think I've got at least 25 days. I'll get to pretend I'm European and take a month off! Cool
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe now you'll have more time to read posts. :P
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Simon_Says wrote:
Maybe now you'll have more time to read posts. Razz


yes, yes. Much planning ahead. Smile
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