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Aramor's kiss and gender norms discussion
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Aramor



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PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 10:49 am    Post subject: Aramor's kiss and gender norms discussion Reply with quote

No... apparently she's questioning my sexuality because when I french kissed a friend of mine just for fun, she saw it as cheating...

While we were driving back home I tried to get it through to her that it means nothing to me... since he's a guy and my best friend... but that didn't really convince her, so when we got home I said I felt really guilty and that I was actually sick to my stomach blahdiblah...

I was about to hurl though, but that was because I had a lot of beer...
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Blaster
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 1:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What? She didn't want to have a threesome with the two of you?
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hypnosys




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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 2:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aramor the noble bitch, you french kissed a friend of the same sex?
male-male?
argh... do you still call that friendship?

ARGH!! EEEEEEEEEEEEEWWWWWWWWW

...

did you enjoy it?
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Aramor



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 4:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blaster wrote:
What? She didn't want to have a threesome with the two of you?


Nope. Actually... she doesn't want any kind of threesome where she has to share me with a third person... so I'm trying to convince her to have a threesome with a lesbian, so I have to share her... big deal Razz

hypnosys wrote:
Aramor the noble bitch, you french kissed a friend of the same sex?
male-male?
argh... do you still call that friendship?

ARGH!! EEEEEEEEEEEEEWWWWWWWWW


What? Wasn't the first time that happened...

hypnosys wrote:
did you enjoy it?


I didn't throw up afterwards... it was actually funny caus he has a tongue piercing... which isn't all that bad when it comes to that sorta stuff. But I can honestly say that it ment nothing... unlike kissing a girl I like. It's like giving your mom a kiss on the cheek before going to bed.
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Digitaaliklosetti



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Blaster wrote:
What? She didn't want to have a threesome with the two of you?

This is what bothers me about that, too. All the chicks I've known would take something like that as a sexual kickstart, or just be pretty indifferent about it. It never even occured to me that you could get a negative response.

Haha. "Sexual kickstart". I'm making that into a song.
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hypnosys




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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

no, Aramor, is like french kissing your mother...
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Aramor



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 12:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really think that's a matter of opinion...
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Digitaaliklosetti



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frenching your mom is a matter of opinion.


...


Another fantastic song title! You guys are gold mine.
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cfos



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 3:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Frenching your mom is a matter of opinion.


...


Another fantastic song title! You guys are gold mine."

... by Lou Reed. Actually, though... his song was "sex with your parents", I think.
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Digitaaliklosetti



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What horrible childhood trauma prevents you from using the quote tags?
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Biomechanical




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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ACK! *Bio bolts from thread*
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cfos



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"What horrible childhood trauma prevents you from using the quote tags?"

5 cls
10 ? "I've always been a cut and paste kind-o-guy."
15 goto 10;

run
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Biomechanical




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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 6:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A stickler for the system i see,lol.......well it may be i just don,t feel like it
or it could be that i,m pretty useless with computers,...shock horror...
A computer geek...i am not.

Got a friend joining soon...he,ll be taking care of my avatar etc...nothing
to get upset over anyway. Wink Appreciate the welcome cfos,lol.

.......''My men don,t do this kind of verk''.....
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Aramor



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Digitaaliklosetti wrote:
Frenching your mom is a matter of opinion.


Is your mom hot? If so, I'll french her...
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hypnosys




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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

if that is a matter of opinion then... it's like having a blow job by one's mother...
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Khushi



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aramor the Nobel Whore wrote:
hypnosys wrote:
Aramor the noble bitch, you french kissed a friend of the same sex?
male-male?
argh... do you still call that friendship?

ARGH!! EEEEEEEEEEEEEWWWWWWWWW


What? Wasn't the first time that happened...


For real?!

... that's pretty hot.
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Munan
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 4:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aramor the Nobel Whore wrote:
No... apparently she's questioning my sexuality.


Will you believe that just yesterday I came across some old letters from 13 years ago by my first girlfriend in which she said she was happy I cheated on her with two girls because it meant I (and I quote) "like girls", a thing she actually doubted.

So, I know how you're feeling and suggest cheating on your girlfriend with two girls just to prove your point. It worked for me...

I also think Khushi gave the only sensible response possible.

Learn from her, people, learn from her.
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Aramor



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 8:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Khushi wrote:
For real?!

... that's pretty hot.


Yeah, well... just be open-minded enough and you'll have no problem doing stuff like that... unlike other people here...

Anyhoo... uhm... Munan, I'll do my best to follow that advice.
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cfos



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2006 11:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Will you believe that just yesterday I came across some old letters from 13 years ago by my first girlfriend in which she said she was happy I cheated on her with two girls because it meant I (and I quote) "like girls", a thing she actually doubted."

Personally, I don't really have an opinion on who kisses whom. But, this post is actully quite interesting (to me):

1. What are you doing with letters from 13 years ago? After moving a third time in 3 years, I've been letting all kinds of crap collected over the years, go... and sometimes, I find it odd that I still have what I have. Is this something common (keeping/trashing)? Or is this something where you save something because it is the "first" letter, etc. I'm curious if other people save these sorts of things.

2. I find it pretty odd that a girl would have that kind of response. I mean, if it was some 13 years ago... that would mean... we are talking about a teenage girl(?). If so, it is either a very progressively minded teenager or a girl that may have questionable likes(?) Maybe she is one to have fallen for guys that like guys, in the past or that you remind her of one? Do most "European" (read: non-American) men come off as potentially bi? -- I'm banking on "European forwading thinking" such that this comment does not come off as insulting, rather just a question because, in my experience, that is a very uncommon response to finding out that one was cheated on.

3. A friend of mine finally burned me a cd of Midnight Vultures (Beck). Is your life (or the lives of other "europeans") embodied in the song "Debra"?
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cfos wrote:
What are you doing with letters from 13 years ago?


Well, I don't know, really, but I have all those letters, still. It's basically like keeping old diaries, I guess. I also still have the letters I exchanged with my best friend, and it is nice, because we still know each other.
I don't know, but what happened back then made a huge impression on me for several reasons and I like to keep those letters, even though I think this was the first time in, like, ten years I read those letters.

Quote:
I find it pretty odd that a girl would have that kind of response.

She was a weird girl, definitely. She was 18, by the way, I was 16.

Quote:
Maybe she is one to have fallen for guys that like guys, in the past or that you remind her of one?


No, no, you misread my post. Her reaction was, oh, thank god, you're not gay/bi. She was from Hungary, where they have rather backward views on homosexuality, so me being bi/gay would definitely not have been a good thing for her.

Quote:
Do most "European" (read: non-American) men come off as potentially bi?


WTF?! First of all, I find saying "non-American=European" a bit weird, and second of all - there's millions of men in Europe, and you have countries like Croatia, Turkey, Greece, or Latvia, where you'll meet with a lot of hostility if people suspect you fancy men, and Sweden, the Netherlands and Belgium, where two men showing affection won't raise too many eyebrows and sometimes gay marriage is possible.

Quote:
A friend of mine finally burned me a cd of Midnight Vultures (Beck). Is your life (or the lives of other "europeans") embodied in the song "Debra"?


I find the notion of having sex with a girl and her sister repulsive. But maybe I misunderstood that song. It's a nice cd, though...
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cfos



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PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

"No, no, you misread my post. Her reaction was, oh, thank god, you're not gay/bi. She was from Hungary, where they have rather backward views on homosexuality, so me being bi/gay would definitely not have been a good thing for her. "

Sorry, my bad. I once went out with a girl who had a hungarian dad. I couldn't get past the dinner -- an appetizer where you put fried chunks of fat on bread.

"WTF?! First of all, I find saying "non-American=European" a bit weird, and second of all - there's millions of men in Europe, and you have countries like Croatia, Turkey, Greece, or Latvia, where you'll meet with a lot of hostility if people suspect you fancy men, and Sweden, the Netherlands and Belgium, where two men showing affection won't raise too many eyebrows and sometimes gay marriage is possible."

Not meant to be weird, some Americans -- those following the "Metrosexual" fad, seem to be a touch European-eske or a wannabe -- Madonna adopting a British accent -- at least my conception of many of them. I don't doubt that there are plenty of countries that are intolerant (you know, the ones that reach the newspapers due to ethnic cleansing, religious wars and what-not) -- just like we have states in "the South". I thought the use of "quotes" might depict the stereotypical European, something which may only exist in the mind. It just seems that most "Europeans" don't have the usual, oh I don't know what you call them... "hang-ups"? that Americans typically display. Likewise, not every emailer from South Africa has millions of $$$ they want to entrust to me. Damn the media!

"I find the notion of having sex with a girl and her sister repulsive. But maybe I misunderstood that song. It's a nice cd, though..."

Hmmm... maybe I mis-read something: When I read your previous post, I assumed you cheated on the former with two girls (at the same time). Hence the Beck song.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh. Yes. In that case, you didn't misread. But they weren't sisters!

cfos wrote:
I once went out with a girl who had a hungarian dad. I couldn't get past the dinner -- an appetizer where you put fried chunks of fat on bread.


I know what you are talking about. Friends of mine were practically raised on that thing, and I remember once, in the summer of '93, I think for two days I had only been drinking and then I woke up in the morning, feeling extremely hungry and someone gave that to me...

Quote:
Not meant to be weird, some Americans -- those following the "Metrosexual" fad, seem to be a touch European-eske or a wannabe -- Madonna adopting a British accent -- at least my conception of many of them.


I'd say that conception of Europe is more revealing about Americans than about what Europe is really like...

Quote:
It just seems that most "Europeans" don't have the usual, oh I don't know what you call them... "hang-ups"? that Americans typically display.


Before I answer that, I need some examples!
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cfos



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PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"I know what you are talking about. Friends of mine were practically raised on that thing, and I remember once, in the summer of '93, I think for two days I had only been drinking and then I woke up in the morning, feeling extremely hungry and someone gave that to me..."

I think I would have been fine if I hadn't been told what it was...

"I'd say that conception of Europe is more revealing about Americans than about what Europe is really like..."

Oh, very true. Of course, most Americans are also far less reserved than any other group when it comes to speaking "our" minds.

"Before I answer that, I need some examples!"

Urinal Etiquette: Unless at an event where there is a mass exodus (movie getting out, sports event) or where a pee trough is the only thing available, most American males will not take the urinal right next to another man (unless emergency) even if it is unoccupied. Rather, the American male will wait.

Teenage Movie going: Before I get the expected comments, let me say that this wasn't the highlight of the trip. While in Paris, my wife and I went to see Miami Vice (we were tired of watching bad American movies dubbed in French). Teenage males in Paris sat right next to each other rather than having a seat between them. As an aside, the Paris movie theaters could seriously use more air conditioning.

"Drama-fags": I think across most schools in America, people that engage in Drama are considered "Drama-fags" (nothing to do with cigarettes) by those not involved in Drama. Not sure why.

Boy-on-boy action: I just don't see Aramor's friendly kiss (the alleged cheating incident) and the question of whether it was "cheating" happening in an American society. Rather, I think the only news that Americans would talk about from the alleged cheating incident would be that he had frenched another guy. Sure, Americans often jokingly feign being "gay" but socially, I think that most would consider that as going beyond the "joke" or have meaning. Personally, I don't really care or have an opinion -- without understanding the nature of the relationship between Aramor and his lady-friend, but have lived in a number of different states and find some universal "truths" amongst some social norms. Of course, if it were Aramor's lady-friend that had kissed another lady-friend... that would be accepted in American culture since we (for some reason) are fascinated by lesbian-action (not stating that they would be lesbians, but that would be the assumption and how it would be described to others who were'nt there to witness the climatic event)... and little people (can't get enough of "Little People, Big World" and wish Fox would bring back the "Littlest Groom").

This is just an observation and maybe the above are not the best examples. But, there are (obviously) some differences that occur in societies that are demographic/cultural?. I've always been curious about these differences (not the geographic differences about whether "soda" is referred to as "pop" or "coke" or whether one says "y'all" or "you guys").
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2006 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some reactions:
cfos wrote:
Urinal Etiquette: Unless at an event where there is a mass exodus (movie getting out, sports event) or where a pee trough is the only thing available, most American males will not take the urinal right next to another man (unless emergency) even if it is unoccupied. Rather, the American male will wait.

I am not sure what you mean ny "most" American males, but I happen to be an American male, and my experiences do not entirely corroborate your assertions. Although most American males will (in my experience) choose a urinal farthest away from any other male, I have never seen a male wait for a urinal when there was an unoccupied one.

cfos wrote:
Teenage Movie going: Teenage males in Paris sat right next to each other rather than having a seat between them.

The "every other seat" seating to which you allude has been an aberration in my experience. Normally I see teenage males sitting next to one another, not to mention that I engaged in the same practice as a teenager.

cfos wrote:
"Drama-fags": I think across most schools in America, people that engage in Drama are considered "Drama-fags" (nothing to do with cigarettes) by those not involved in Drama. Not sure why.

That is, of course, a reflection of a long-standing, perceived connection between male homosexuals and the theater. It's a stereotype, certainly, but I find it hard to believe that you are ignorant of it.

Re: Boy-on-boy action:
I would also frame the incident in terms of infidelity rather than alleging any homosexuality. But Aramor and his girlfriend are entitled to determine for themselves the parameters of their relationship.

cfos wrote:
This is just an observation and maybe the above are not the best examples. But, there are (obviously) some differences that occur in societies that are demographic/cultural?. I've always been curious about these differences (not the geographic differences about whether "soda" is referred to as "pop" or "coke" or whether one says "y'all" or "you guys").

Indeed. Perhaps some of these things have changed in time as well.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2006 1:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I have never seen a male wait for a urinal when there was an unoccupied one.


Ditto.

American men don't get caught up in drama at my school, all the girls take care of that. 2 girls have passed out from caffeine over doses, and many more continually complain about stress and life and overloaded schedules, but I honestly don't see guys at my school coming off as drama fags, and very few men here participate in metrosexualism, but I do have doubts about Munan. Are you gay?
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